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Ergo-Log Study: slower reps=more muscle growth

Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:54 pm
by matter2003
-very interesting study that just came out...muscle "Time Under Tension" seems to be an important factor in muscle growth

The slower your reps, the more your muscles grow

Research done by Nicholas Burd, a sports scientist in the Stuart Phillips stable, may well radically change the way we do strength training in the coming decade. Then again, it might not work. Nevertheless, 'muscle time under tension' looks set to become a familiar concept, and one we can't ignore.

We first reported on Burd's research in the summer of 2010. The subject then was a study in which men who had trained with just 30 percent of their maximal weight – doing 20-30 reps – had built more muscle proteins than men who had trained in the traditional way.

The researchers' theory is that weight isn't the most important factor in strength training, or at least not the only important factor. Equally important is 'muscle time under tension': the amount of time that muscles are placed under tension during weight lifting. Elite trainer Charles Poliquin has been telling that yor years. [charlespoliquin.com]

The researchers will now soon publish the results of their latest study in The Journal of Physiology, in which they subjected the left and right legs of strength athletes to two different workouts. They got the men to train one leg on a leg-extension machine, using weights at 30 percent of their 1RM. The men had to perform the movements slowly, taking 6 seconds for both the concentric and the eccentric movement. The men trained at failure and did 3 sets. [SLOW]


With the other leg the men had to perform the same number of sets, with the same weight. But they performed these movements 'normally' and therefore didn't train at failure. [CTL]

Immediately after the workout the subjects drank a shake containing 20 g whey, and another one 24 hours later.

The workout with the slow reps resulted in the highest muscle protein synthesis – the researchers saw this when they examined cells they had extracted from the leg muscles of the test subjects. This was true for both the contracting myofibrillar protein [the protein in the muscle fibres] and the mitochondrial protein [the cells' power packs]. The latter suggests that strength training with slow reps may be interesting for endurance athletes too.

Image

The figure above shows how slow-rep strength training results in enhanced muscle protein synthesis. Electrode measurements show that the slow-rep sets induced more muscle fibres to be used in the movement.

"These results suggest that the time the muscle is under tension during exercise may be important in optimizing muscle growth", the researchers write. "This understanding enables us to better prescribe exercise to those wishing to build bigger muscles and to prevent muscle loss that occurs with aging or disease."

Perhaps we shouldn't write off the super-slow method just yet…


Here is the study link:
https://ergo-log.com/thesloweryourreps.html

Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 4:46 pm
by bigpelo
Two things I note on this study:

1. they measure muscle protein after 6 and 24 hours and conclude that it increased muscle growth. What about 2 days later? 2 weeks later? Does this translate to lean body weight gain? I doubt.

2.
They got the men to train one leg on a leg-extension machine, using weights at 30 percent of their 1RM. The men had to perform the movements slowly, taking 6 seconds for both the concentric and the eccentric movement. The men trained at failure and did 3 sets. [SLOW]

With the other leg the men had to perform the same number of sets, with the same weight. But they performed these movements 'normally' and therefore didn't train at failure.
I would like to see a comparison between 30% 1RM slow rep to failure with same # of reps in a 2-0-1 standard lifting to failure (maybe 70-80%?) They trained subject legs to failure and had better protein synthesis (NOT net lean mass gain, see point#1) than subject legs not to failure... Isn't it why we push ourselves in the gym? getting to failure from time to time???

In my opinion, this study suffers strong limitations and the conclusion is way too optimistic.

Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2012 8:26 pm
by BrainSquirt
In my opinion, all studies suffer strong limitations and the conclusions are way too optimistic. :lol: :wink:
ie It’s highly individualized!
Find your own best combination and sequencing of all four:
Fast heavy, slow heavy, fast light, slow light

Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 7:14 am
by RobRegish
Brain has the right idea. Slow reps may confer greater size. Guess what they do for power? ZERO...

Fast = first. Slow = 3rd string in strength sports.

Before you know it, those dumb metronomes or whatever, will be back. Everyone will be counting seconds up/down and we'll be mired in minutia. Here's your solution:

Lower the weight slower than you raise it. When you raise it, explode up.

Best of both worlds... :)

Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:30 pm
by DaCookie
RobRegish wrote:Brain has the right idea. Slow reps may confer greater size. Guess what they do for power? ZERO...

Fast = first. Slow = 3rd string in strength sports.

Before you know it, those dumb metronomes or whatever, will be back. Everyone will be counting seconds up/down and we'll be mired in minutia. Here's your solution:

Lower the weight slower than you raise it. When you raise it, explode up.

Best of both worlds... :)
Gotta agree with that, works a lot better for me in some muscle groups like biceps for example.I pause at the peak now too.That way you are getting your positive, negative and static.If you can recover from that then I believe its much better.

Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:34 pm
by DaCookie
So ive been experimenting with lifting in this manner-As fast as possible on the positive, as slow as possible on negative(Or as slow as pump will allow), holding it at the peak static part of the movement for like 1 second.

Found that this works for me for biceps, triceps, chest and I think traps and shoulders but I need to experiment more.Im doing around the 10 rep mark and about 5 sets in EDT fashion unless its squats or deadlifts.

I can say with quite a bit of confidence that this doesnt work for back so much as the others but I could be wrong.

I find its like Rob says, does basically nothing for power, but damn if your nutrition is on point and youve never done this before I really recommend it.Great for size gains.Also im doing only full body workouts twice a week, this really needs emphasis, sometimes even 48hours after my last training session I feel I could do with another 12 hours of recovery.

Since this does nothing for power almost, every 3rd or 4th session I do is a workout based in 3 reps 3 sets range lifting as normal.Gonna mix it up soon with some static holds too.

Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 10:33 pm
by Dragon
RobRegish wrote:Brain has the right idea. Slow reps may confer greater size. Guess what they do for power? ZERO...

Fast = first. Slow = 3rd string in strength sports.

Before you know it, those dumb metronomes or whatever, will be back. Everyone will be counting seconds up/down and we'll be mired in minutia. Here's your solution:

Lower the weight slower than you raise it. When you raise it, explode up.

Best of both worlds... :)
Rob! I heard you speak on SH radio about this a bit, I believe it's show number 940 if you guys haven't checked it out yet.

Interestingly my boss, who was a wrestler and a NSCA certified trainer, approached me 3 days ago (right when I finished feast) and commented on how much healthier I look, at which point I took the opportunity to tell him about BP of course.
I guess he felt I was of a mindset to understand him in terms of physical culture since I grew stronger right before his eyes. In a loud and booming voice he frequently asks, "how's the muscle building going kid?!?" LOL

So he showed me an amazing machine (IMO) that he invented and obtained the patent on. York Barbell was looking at it but wouldn't buy a unit unless he forked over 50k for studies. He explained, in so many words, that getting a product onto the market is expensive and difficult.

Anyways, this machine can actually load the barbell heavier on the eccentric phase and lighten the bar on the concentric phase. So on the vid he showed me - a man was bench pressing 150 lbs, hard and fast up, and straining to lower 250 lbs on the way down. By the way, the barbell is NOT on a track like a smith machine so all the play and sway of a normal barbell is maintained - it also uses olympic plates.

There is also a "stop and lift" sensor built into the bar that prevents the weight from crushing the user in the event that he/she fails to lift the weight off their chest.

He said he's trained ecto body types on it and he seems to pride himself in that saying how, "anyone can take a meso and put muscle on him, but you have to know what you're doing to put muscle on a guy like you."

I had no idea my boss was so smart.

I can't wait to use it!!!!!

Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:33 pm
by matter2003
Dragon wrote:
RobRegish wrote:Brain has the right idea. Slow reps may confer greater size. Guess what they do for power? ZERO...

Fast = first. Slow = 3rd string in strength sports.

Before you know it, those dumb metronomes or whatever, will be back. Everyone will be counting seconds up/down and we'll be mired in minutia. Here's your solution:

Lower the weight slower than you raise it. When you raise it, explode up.

Best of both worlds... :)
Rob! I heard you speak on SH radio about this a bit, I believe it's show number 940 if you guys haven't checked it out yet.

Interestingly my boss, who was a wrestler and a NSCA certified trainer, approached me 3 days ago (right when I finished feast) and commented on how much healthier I look, at which point I took the opportunity to tell him about BP of course.
I guess he felt I was of a mindset to understand him in terms of physical culture since I grew stronger right before his eyes. In a loud and booming voice he frequently asks, "how's the muscle building going kid?!?" LOL

So he showed me an amazing machine (IMO) that he invented and obtained the patent on. York Barbell was looking at it but wouldn't buy a unit unless he forked over 50k for studies. He explained, in so many words, that getting a product onto the market is expensive and difficult.

Anyways, this machine can actually load the barbell heavier on the eccentric phase and lighten the bar on the concentric phase. So on the vid he showed me - a man was bench pressing 150 lbs, hard and fast up, and straining to lower 250 lbs on the way down. By the way, the barbell is NOT on a track like a smith machine so all the play and sway of a normal barbell is maintained - it also uses olympic plates.

There is also a "stop and lift" sensor built into the bar that prevents the weight from crushing the user in the event that he/she fails to lift the weight off their chest.

He said he's trained ecto body types on it and he seems to pride himself in that saying how, "anyone can take a meso and put muscle on him, but you have to know what you're doing to put muscle on a guy like you."

I had no idea my boss was so smart.

I can't wait to use it!!!!!
That sounds really cool...believe it or not Rob was an ecto at one point....